MALAGUTI FIREFOX F15 HELP
- Thread starter benelz
- Start date
Lodewijk
ok
If it is in the original state, you will need 6 to 6,8grams rollers. Original (white) clutch-spring. Original smallsprings (dont know the name). Take out the ring that is in the variomatic system if it is still there. Derestrict the original exhaust (in the front where it connects to the cylinder, and also in the silencer if it is a new type exhaust). You will proably have to go up in mainjet a little. This should get your topspeed at +- 80km/h (about 50mph I think) with a good acceleration
benelz
Firefox Rider
Ok thanks very much - will this be full derestriction?
also if I was to buy a new Leo Vince TT exhaust (http://tinyurl.com/y85w6s2) would I need to derestrict the exhaust and silencer?
Without a Sports Exhaust what speed would I be looking at? And with the one named above?
Thanks a LOT!
also if I was to buy a new Leo Vince TT exhaust (http://tinyurl.com/y85w6s2) would I need to derestrict the exhaust and silencer?
Without a Sports Exhaust what speed would I be looking at? And with the one named above?
Thanks a LOT!
Last edited:
Lodewijk
ok
My firefox was from '99 so I'm not sure if the 2002 version has any other restrictions, but usually on minarelli scooters its just the ring in the vario and the ring/cilinder in the exhaust (where it connects to the cil). In newer types they added a restriction in the end of the exhaust, just before or after the silencer.
A leo TT isn't really any better than the original exhaust, just a different sound and it needs more RPM to run properly so there will be more uhm.. "wear and tear"
A leo TT isn't really any better than the original exhaust, just a different sound and it needs more RPM to run properly so there will be more uhm.. "wear and tear"
Lodewijk
ok
I have had a technigas (I dont know which one it was sorry..) under my firefox, it took the topspeed from 85km/u with the original exhaust to 93km/u (on gps as well as digital speedometer), but my rollers went from 6,8grams to 4,2grams so I had to ride around with a lot of noise (because of the high PRM).
Not really worth the 8km/u which is like 3 or 4 mph I think.. 93 was the absolute top, usually it went around 90. The 85 on the original exhaust was easily reached
Here you can my firefoxes as they were when I bought them, with the good exhaust:
If you dont have that exhaust and cant get your hands on it, try finding this one (Even older.. original old model beta ark exhaust)
Both run great on 50cc and also very good on 70cc if you remove the first plate in the exhaust (so you have to open it up and weld again)
Not really worth the 8km/u which is like 3 or 4 mph I think.. 93 was the absolute top, usually it went around 90. The 85 on the original exhaust was easily reached
Here you can my firefoxes as they were when I bought them, with the good exhaust:
If you dont have that exhaust and cant get your hands on it, try finding this one (Even older.. original old model beta ark exhaust)
Both run great on 50cc and also very good on 70cc if you remove the first plate in the exhaust (so you have to open it up and weld again)
benelz
Firefox Rider
@Lodyx
So all you did was derestrict the variator and replace the exhaust - Did you do any other tuning? With the Leo Vince TT exhaust it comes with springs and rollers that it says are optimum for it (http://tinyurl.com/y85w6s2) so do you think the ones supplied with it would be best?
The main reason for buying a sports exhaust isn't for the extra few mph its more for the derestriction, if i bought the vince tt then i would only have to remove one thing from the exhaust and no welding would be required which if done incorrectly would lead to a lot more problems than spending £80 'ish' on a new exhaust which is MUCH easier to derestrict (http://tinyurl.com/ybk4u3d)
Is this correct?
After derestricting, replacing the rollers and springs, and adding a new sports exhaust, would I need to upjet?
What size jets would you guys recommend if I was buying a new exhaust? - Something like this (http://tinyurl.com/ydxjfq8)?
Or a set that is larger/smaller?
Upjetting means using larger jets I guess?
Many thanks Lodyx
So all you did was derestrict the variator and replace the exhaust - Did you do any other tuning? With the Leo Vince TT exhaust it comes with springs and rollers that it says are optimum for it (http://tinyurl.com/y85w6s2) so do you think the ones supplied with it would be best?
The main reason for buying a sports exhaust isn't for the extra few mph its more for the derestriction, if i bought the vince tt then i would only have to remove one thing from the exhaust and no welding would be required which if done incorrectly would lead to a lot more problems than spending £80 'ish' on a new exhaust which is MUCH easier to derestrict (http://tinyurl.com/ybk4u3d)
Is this correct?
After derestricting, replacing the rollers and springs, and adding a new sports exhaust, would I need to upjet?
What size jets would you guys recommend if I was buying a new exhaust? - Something like this (http://tinyurl.com/ydxjfq8)?
Or a set that is larger/smaller?
Upjetting means using larger jets I guess?
Many thanks Lodyx
Last edited:
Lodewijk
ok
The exhaust that is on my photos is the original firefox exhaust. If you have that one, then you only have to remove the ring/cilinder that is in the beginning of the exhaust. Then it is derestricted. If you have the newer exhaust where the silencer points to your frontwheel instead of to the back, then there is a second restriction in the turn from exhaust to silencer, or in the silencer itsself.. im not sure
Anyway if you decide to use your leovince exhaust then I would recommend going up 2 sizes in jet and adjust your carburation from there. I cant tell you what size you will need exactly, even if you have two identical scooters with exactly the same parts it can still differ. It will probably be between 68 and 78 if your scooter is original.
Other than the restriction in the exhaust and the extra ring in the vario, there are no restrictors. You understood correctly. If all parts are properly adjusted (jet, rollers, springs) and the parts are derestricted you should be able to hit the 80km/h without much trouble.
The parts that come with an exhaust are never "optimal" because like I said before, one scooter may need 3,5gr rollers with that exhaust, another may run well with 5,5grams. It is a matter of testing. Don't expect to have the exhaust installed AND everything properly adjusted in an hour or two
Just take your time for it, if you need the scoooter to go to school or work than do it on a friday afternoon
oh by the way, the reason that I wouldn't take the TT is because it doesn't do much more than the original exhaust, it just forces you to adjust the rollers springs jet etc.. and you have to take the original exhaust of the cilinder anyway (to derestrict or replace with TT) and derestrict AN exhaust anyway.. I wouldn't take that trouble its not worth the few extra km/h that the TT MIGHT give you
Anyway if you decide to use your leovince exhaust then I would recommend going up 2 sizes in jet and adjust your carburation from there. I cant tell you what size you will need exactly, even if you have two identical scooters with exactly the same parts it can still differ. It will probably be between 68 and 78 if your scooter is original.
Other than the restriction in the exhaust and the extra ring in the vario, there are no restrictors. You understood correctly. If all parts are properly adjusted (jet, rollers, springs) and the parts are derestricted you should be able to hit the 80km/h without much trouble.
The parts that come with an exhaust are never "optimal" because like I said before, one scooter may need 3,5gr rollers with that exhaust, another may run well with 5,5grams. It is a matter of testing. Don't expect to have the exhaust installed AND everything properly adjusted in an hour or two
Just take your time for it, if you need the scoooter to go to school or work than do it on a friday afternoon
oh by the way, the reason that I wouldn't take the TT is because it doesn't do much more than the original exhaust, it just forces you to adjust the rollers springs jet etc.. and you have to take the original exhaust of the cilinder anyway (to derestrict or replace with TT) and derestrict AN exhaust anyway.. I wouldn't take that trouble
its not worth the few extra km/h that the TT MIGHT give you
benelz
Firefox Rider
Ok I have taken a couple of photos
The first is the exhaust that came with the moped (I'm fairly sure its the original) - the silencer doesn't point to the front wheel so do you reckon there is a restriction in there?
[IR]http://i589.photobucket.com/albums/ss340/benelz/Moped/100_0072.jpg?t=1260974460[/IR]
However where the exhaust connects back to the bike/cylinder there is this small 'pipe' sort of thing that sticks out - I have read that to fully restrict this must be removed and welded - is this correct?
Here's a photo (sorry about the quality of the second one - it was kinda hard to get a photo as its right under the ped)
[IR]http://i589.photobucket.com/albums/ss340/benelz/Moped/100_0075.jpg?t=1260974600[/IR]
The first is the exhaust that came with the moped (I'm fairly sure its the original) - the silencer doesn't point to the front wheel so do you reckon there is a restriction in there?
[IR]http://i589.photobucket.com/albums/ss340/benelz/Moped/100_0072.jpg?t=1260974460[/IR]
However where the exhaust connects back to the bike/cylinder there is this small 'pipe' sort of thing that sticks out - I have read that to fully restrict this must be removed and welded - is this correct?
Here's a photo (sorry about the quality of the second one - it was kinda hard to get a photo as its right under the ped)
[IR]http://i589.photobucket.com/albums/ss340/benelz/Moped/100_0075.jpg?t=1260974600[/IR]
Last edited by a moderator:
Lodewijk
ok
Well I dont know if this is the original exhaust, the silencer looks the same as mine but much bigger, the same goes for the middle part of the exhaust. The turn seems exactly the same. However I doubt that this will be as good as the exhaust on my pictures, as that one has an expansion part (im not sure how you call it in english), yours is very big (the middle part, beween the turn and the silcencer) so it probably has round plates with small holes in it. This is good voor acceleration but bad for topspeed
Also you are correct about the second photo: it IS bad quality.... no just kidding But yes that is a restrictor and needs to be cut of and then the hole has to be welded shut.
So knowing your situation, I'd say: go for the leovince TT if you already purchased it
Also you are correct about the second photo: it IS bad quality.... no just kidding
But yes that is a restrictor and needs to be cut of and then the hole has to be welded shut.So knowing your situation, I'd say: go for the leovince TT if you already purchased it
benelz
Firefox Rider
yeah cool - I think I will, the current exhaust is HUGE and also a bit rusty and I'm far from a welding pro!
Thanks Lodyx, you've been VERY helpful, I guess its just about fiddling about with the rollers, springs and jets until I get the best set up!
Is there a guide that I can use for getting into the variator? And will I need a variator tool?
Thanks, Ben
Thanks Lodyx, you've been VERY helpful, I guess its just about fiddling about with the rollers, springs and jets until I get the best set up!
Is there a guide that I can use for getting into the variator? And will I need a variator tool?
Thanks, Ben
Last edited:
Lodewijk
ok
You need a special tool to block the vario so you can turn the bolt on the crankshaft loose.
This one to be exact:
Avoid using the type of blocking tool that you have to screw into the head of the cilinder (sorry my english lacks when it comes to these specific terms). It CAN damage the moving part inside your cilinder (piston?) when used improperly, plus its more work than with the tool on the image.
The brand of that tool is Buzetti (the one I have) by the way.. maybe this will help you find it since I dont know what the name is in English
This one to be exact:
Avoid using the type of blocking tool that you have to screw into the head of the cilinder (sorry my english lacks when it comes to these specific terms
). It CAN damage the moving part inside your cilinder (piston?) when used improperly, plus its more work than with the tool on the image. The brand of that tool is Buzetti (the one I have) by the way.. maybe this will help you find it since I dont know what the name is in English
benelz
Firefox Rider
this is buzetti - does it look right, the website says its compatible with the F15 but i just wanna double check with you guys (http://tinyurl.com/ylsfkzb)
Is it harmful if you don't upjet after adding a new derestricted exhaust or does it just limit perfomance?
Is it harmful if you don't upjet after adding a new derestricted exhaust or does it just limit perfomance?
Last edited:
Lodewijk
ok
It's not the one I used, but it says mina horizontal so it should fit. I actually have that one in my garage now that I think of it, but I've never used it (bought it in a garage sale didn't know for what engine it was). So yes you can buy that one. I would recommend getting parts/tools at the scootershop in your city because it is a lot easier to go back when something is wrong
Not installing a bigger jet can cause your gasoline/air mix to have too much air (well.. too little gasoline) which makes the "fire" (the ignition?) a lot hotter which is bad for your scooter. If your scooter is still in its origainal state now then I would definately recommend putting in a bigger jet. You should have at least a 68, probably larger (72 or 74). Dont pin me down on the numbers because its been a while since I sold my last firefox (sadly enough) and with that, my last minareli horizontal engine.
And yes the logical downside is that a not properly callibrated carburator will also give you a bad performance
Not installing a bigger jet can cause your gasoline/air mix to have too much air (well.. too little gasoline) which makes the "fire" (the ignition?) a lot hotter which is bad for your scooter. If your scooter is still in its origainal state now then I would definately recommend putting in a bigger jet. You should have at least a 68, probably larger (72 or 74). Dont pin me down on the numbers because its been a while since I sold my last firefox (sadly enough) and with that, my last minareli horizontal engine.
And yes the logical downside is that a not properly callibrated carburator will also give you a bad performance
Lodewijk
ok
Ok I don't remember everything perfectly but I'll try to help you.
To ease up reaching the carb you should take away the plates that your feet rest on when you ride (just the rubber mats, you can pull them out they arekinda pushed in.. no screws). Then you have access to the screws that keep the bottom bodypart of your firefox in its place. There is also a screw on both sides where it is conncected to the front bodyplate of your scooter (That has the lights in it). Unscrew them all untill the bottom bodyplate comes off, just the colored one (not the one your feet stand on). It may take some fiddling to get it away from under there.
Now you can reach the carb. I hope for you that the vacuum of your gasolinetank is working correctly, because then you can just use a wrench (14 i think.. might also be tight up with 2screws instead of a bolt) to unscrew the bottom part of the carburator. Take the thing (ill post an image below) that has come loose away AS IT IS MOUNTED. Other wise the gasoline will be all over your hands. If your vacuum is working correctly then there should be no gasoline coming from the carburator. If it does and keeps coming you'd better have a few empty jars ready to catch it all
Now when you look at the bottom of the carburator there is a golden screw with a very small hole trough it. Unscrew it GENTLY use a fitting screwdriver. It has a number written on the sise, probably betwwen 58 and 68. Take it to the scootershop and ask for 1 size bigger (the numbers are always even, so if you have 68 then 1 size bigger is 70)
Ofcourse this is after you mount your new exhaust or at least on the same day
the black thing on the bottom needs to be removed to gain access to your jet
here you see a screwdriver unscrewing the jet
To ease up reaching the carb you should take away the plates that your feet rest on when you ride (just the rubber mats, you can pull them out they arekinda pushed in.. no screws). Then you have access to the screws that keep the bottom bodypart of your firefox in its place. There is also a screw on both sides where it is conncected to the front bodyplate of your scooter (That has the lights in it). Unscrew them all untill the bottom bodyplate comes off, just the colored one (not the one your feet stand on). It may take some fiddling to get it away from under there.
Now you can reach the carb. I hope for you that the vacuum of your gasolinetank is working correctly, because then you can just use a wrench (14 i think.. might also be tight up with 2screws instead of a bolt) to unscrew the bottom part of the carburator. Take the thing (ill post an image below) that has come loose away AS IT IS MOUNTED. Other wise the gasoline will be all over your hands
. If your vacuum is working correctly then there should be no gasoline coming from the carburator. If it does and keeps coming you'd better have a few empty jars ready to catch it all Now when you look at the bottom of the carburator there is a golden screw with a very small hole trough it. Unscrew it GENTLY use a fitting screwdriver. It has a number written on the sise, probably betwwen 58 and 68. Take it to the scootershop and ask for 1 size bigger (the numbers are always even, so if you have 68 then 1 size bigger is 70)
Ofcourse this is after you mount your new exhaust or at least on the same day
the black thing on the bottom needs to be removed to gain access to your jet
here you see a screwdriver unscrewing the jet
